Ditko Spiderman page?

[Dick Pontoon]

I agree he's either a crook or a boob; I was just posing some possibilities that occured to me. Plus he's from the Pacific Northwest, home to many shady comic auctions and doings. No offense to any boardies in the area!

[chrisco37]

Plus he's from the Pacific Northwest, home to many shady comic auctions and doings.

 

 

Just outside of Portland, Oregon, no less!

[Mister Trent]

It's definitely page 11 from issue #35 for sure, I looked last night in my Marvel Masterworks. So it's odd that it has issue 28 marked on it. Of course, if it's a forgery or someone doing a "recreation" of a Ditko page, or some type of stat it's hard to tell due to the lousy pictures the guy has up.

 

The "28" alone wouldn't convince me it was a forge. I know Kirby would often remove finished pages from a story, and they'd sometimes be inserted elsewhere later down the line or not used at all. Since this is mostly an action page with no plot-specific references, it could have been drawn for 28 and used later in 35.

 

Besides, that seems like a really weird and obvious mistake to make if its fake.

 

The page is from a lengthy action sequence from # 35. By this stage in Spidey's run, Ditko's inking had become lighter and more delicate - especially on the costume's webbing details. As such, I think it's extremely unlikely that this is a discarded page from # 28.

 

If you know your Ditko Spidey compare this eBay offering against the # 28 story - you won't see anywhere it would fit in (if you want to promote this idea of a 'discarded' page).

 

Do you actually have #s 28 and 35 to refer to???

[Dick Pontoon]

It's definitely page 11 from issue #35 for sure, I looked last night in my Marvel Masterworks. So it's odd that it has issue 28 marked on it. Of course, if it's a forgery or someone doing a "recreation" of a Ditko page, or some type of stat it's hard to tell due to the lousy pictures the guy has up.

 

The "28" alone wouldn't convince me it was a forge. I know Kirby would often remove finished pages from a story, and they'd sometimes be inserted elsewhere later down the line or not used at all. Since this is mostly an action page with no plot-specific references, it could have been drawn for 28 and used later in 35.

 

Besides, that seems like a really weird and obvious mistake to make if its fake.

 

The page is from a lengthy action sequence from # 35. By this stage in Spidey's run, Ditko's inking had become lighter and more delicate - especially on the costume's webbing details. As such, I think it's extremely unlikely that this is a discarded page from # 28.

 

If you know your Ditko Spidey compare this eBay offering against the # 28 story - you won't see anywhere it would fit in (if you want to promote this idea of a 'discarded' page).

 

Do you actually have #s 28 and 35 to refer to???

 

I'll buy that argument! Twas merely a hypothesis; without having looked at 28 in some time I couldn't recall if it would've fit somewhere or not.

 

And yeah, I have both of those issues. They're not that uncommon! Why would I lie about that?

 

And I do plan to look at them later for the heck of it.

[Spider-Variant]

It's definitely page 11 from issue #35 for sure, I looked last night in my Marvel Masterworks. So it's odd that it has issue 28 marked on it. Of course, if it's a forgery or someone doing a "recreation" of a Ditko page, or some type of stat it's hard to tell due to the lousy pictures the guy has up.

 

The "28" alone wouldn't convince me it was a forge. I know Kirby would often remove finished pages from a story, and they'd sometimes be inserted elsewhere later down the line or not used at all. Since this is mostly an action page with no plot-specific references, it could have been drawn for 28 and used later in 35.

 

Besides, that seems like a really weird and obvious mistake to make if its fake.

 

The page is from a lengthy action sequence from # 35. By this stage in Spidey's run, Ditko's inking had become lighter and more delicate - especially on the costume's webbing details. As such, I think it's extremely unlikely that this is a discarded page from # 28.

 

If you know your Ditko Spidey compare this eBay offering against the # 28 story - you won't see anywhere it would fit in (if you want to promote this idea of a 'discarded' page).

 

Do you actually have #s 28 and 35 to refer to???

 

I'll buy that argument! Twas merely a hypothesis; without having looked at 28 in some time I couldn't recall if it would've fit somewhere or not.

 

And yeah, I have both of those issues. They're not that uncommon! Why would I lie about that?

 

And I do plan to look at them later for the heck of it.

 

Actually, I did look yesterday afternoon to see if this hypothesis was even a possibility. I agree it just doesn't fit. I guess if you look at page #12 to issue #35, the inking matches perfectly to page #11. Both pages #11 and #12 from issue 35 look different than those in issue #28.

[Mister Trent]

It's definitely page 11 from issue #35 for sure, I looked last night in my Marvel Masterworks. So it's odd that it has issue 28 marked on it. Of course, if it's a forgery or someone doing a "recreation" of a Ditko page, or some type of stat it's hard to tell due to the lousy pictures the guy has up.

 

The "28" alone wouldn't convince me it was a forge. I know Kirby would often remove finished pages from a story, and they'd sometimes be inserted elsewhere later down the line or not used at all. Since this is mostly an action page with no plot-specific references, it could have been drawn for 28 and used later in 35.

 

Besides, that seems like a really weird and obvious mistake to make if its fake.

 

The page is from a lengthy action sequence from # 35. By this stage in Spidey's run, Ditko's inking had become lighter and more delicate - especially on the costume's webbing details. As such, I think it's extremely unlikely that this is a discarded page from # 28.

 

If you know your Ditko Spidey compare this eBay offering against the # 28 story - you won't see anywhere it would fit in (if you want to promote this idea of a 'discarded' page).

 

Do you actually have #s 28 and 35 to refer to???

 

I'll buy that argument! Twas merely a hypothesis; without having looked at 28 in some time I couldn't recall if it would've fit somewhere or not.

 

And yeah, I have both of those issues. They're not that uncommon! Why would I lie about that?

 

Sorry, not my intention to suggest you were a liar. I was just wondering if you'd done any homework to support your theory?

[Dick Pontoon]

No problem!

 

After my 1st post yesterday morning, I hadn't looked at this thread until today so I hadn't seen the ebay listing in question or had a chance to look at anything before thinking out loud. I'll just head back to General.

 

MisterTrent - I never heard back from you as to whether you'd ever heard Jason King's album.

[Steve Morger]

I have a slightly different take on this auction. First off, I think the art is bogus -- not by Ditko. However, I think the guy is doing a great job on the auction, and I do think the auction is more than a little shady. By running the auction the way he's doing it, he's appealling to the greed in more than a few of the bidders who think they are taking advantage of an uninformed seller. Yet, when they bid and win and end up with a worthless piece of non-Ditko art, the seller can legitimately say "I warned you." Buyer gets nothing and seller gets to keep the inflated value. Can't wait (sarcasm here) to see other sellers grab onto this scheme.

[blowout]

I have a slightly different take on this auction. First off, I think the art is bogus -- not by Ditko. However, I think the guy is doing a great job on the auction, and I do think the auction is more than a little shady. By running the auction the way he's doing it, he's appealling to the greed in more than a few of the bidders who think they are taking advantage of an uninformed seller. Yet, when they bid and win and end up with a worthless piece of non-Ditko art, the seller can legitimately say "I warned you." Buyer gets nothing and seller gets to keep the inflated value. Can't wait (sarcasm here) to see other sellers grab onto this scheme.

 

Unfortunately, this seems to be the most likely explanation. With the prices that Ditko Spideys have been fetching lately, it's also not that surprising.

[aardvark88]

I emailed the seller, and asked if I could pick up the art in person as he will not ship to Canada. Just a 6 hr drive south to the Portland, OR area if that is where he actually resides to verify authenticity. No reply yet.

[NightGallery1]

Steve - I couldn't have said it better. It seems like this guy is as slick as goose *spoon* and just as dirty. At this point the listing actually says "Buyer Beware".

 

He's done everything except actually state that he's going to rip you off, but he's handled the whole situation with such guile that only two out of the original eight bidders have retracted with a little over an hour to go.

[Mister Trent]

MisterTrent - I never heard back from you as to whether you'd ever heard Jason King's album.

 

Jason King's album? Remind me.

[Mister Trent]

I have a slightly different take on this auction. First off, I think the art is bogus -- not by Ditko. However, I think the guy is doing a great job on the auction, and I do think the auction is more than a little shady. By running the auction the way he's doing it, he's appealling to the greed in more than a few of the bidders who think they are taking advantage of an uninformed seller. Yet, when they bid and win and end up with a worthless piece of non-Ditko art, the seller can legitimately say "I warned you." Buyer gets nothing and seller gets to keep the inflated value. Can't wait (sarcasm here) to see other sellers grab onto this scheme.

 

I think it goes without saying that this auction is more than a little shady!

[chrisco37]

Final Price: $2,036.00

 

Anyone know the winning bidder? rein0246

 

I hope he's got that kind of money to spare. Will be interesting to see how this all pans out after the buyer receives the artwork.

[aardvark88]

The seller was willing to let me pick up the "artwork" in person if I was top bidder. He protected himself beautifully by clearing stating in his email the item is NOT being sold as a Ditko. Some poor eBayer just flushed $2k -- NO way this is legit OA.

[2 Sharpe's Collecting]

Some poor eBayer just flushed $2k

 

Doesn't anyone else think it's strange that the winning bidder registered on eBay the day before the acution ended? Personally, I think this "'winning bidder" is the seller registered under another name.

[Artemaria]

I agree with the last poster that there is something very suspicious about the winning bidder registering on eBay ten seconds before the auction. However, I know that the winning bidder was not the seller.

 

I know one of the bidders on that page who has been in contact with the seller since the auction. He told me that the seller shipped off the page already, so we should know soon as to whether the page was a fake or not. My friend who bid on the page was not sure that it was real, but felt strongly enough to put some money where his mouth was.

 

On the flip side, I think that the seller was fairly innocent in all of this. As collectors, we are used to a certain type of behavior and personality in other collectors. Many, although by no means all collectors, but a decent number, especially when you get to the high end stuff, are fairly aggressive people. They would have to be to get what they want.

 

Now imagine this computer geek in Oregon. He lives in the woods. He just sold a keyboard for $15 in his last eBay auction. He loves nature and birdwatching. He bought some *spoon* at an estate auction probably because the auction included a 40 year old quilt that he could give to his girlfriend who spends her spare time knitting. Maybe, just maybe, the seller is working in the computer industry because he is a little socially awkward. Maybe he doesn't like being around people.

 

Then he puts this page on eBay. And his simple, quiet life . . . . changes.

 

He gets 15,000 e-mails in 2 hours. He deletes as many as he can, but they don't stop. He gets hundreds of offers from people in NYC to come over his house and check out his page. Some people tell him that the page is worth $20K, some tell him that the page is worthless. He doesn't know. Rather than face a lawsuit from those crazy people in NYC, he just writes on the auction - I have no idea what this is. Bid at your own risk.

 

Maybe he can't interrupt or doesn't want to interrupt his life to put in the work necessary to validate the page. Maybe there are other reasons for his behavior. I just don't think the seller was the one being dishonest here.

 

Maybe the high bidder was someone who told others that it was a fake but knew it was real all along. Maybe the high bidder is someone who knew why the page was marked 28, and had an ASM stamp when none of the others of that issue did, etc. Maybe the high bidder did not want to identify himself to the community because he would lose some friends. It would be unprecedented for a newbie to take a $2K gamble on something like this. The high bidder knew what he was doing.

 

Is it a fake because everyone tells everyone else that it is a fake? I don't know. I hope to find out soon.

[aardvark88]

But by being a computer geek, he could have easily googled Spider-man original art or searched eBay for Heritage auctions to realize IF it is authentic 1960s Ditko it is worth $20k. That means he gave up $18k (which would buy a top of the line computer upgrade or a car so he could get a date) because he would not consign it to 1 of his eBay contacts (NYC Illustration House) ?

 

I am sure Heritage scouts would have solicited him directly via email as the eBay auction was live to ask to handle the consignment at top $$ IF they thought it was legit.

[Artemaria]

As you are aware, the scouts did solicit him. It is in the 20 questions that were posted on the auction.

 

However, by that point, it seems like he had his fill of the swarms, and was giving his stock reply that he was cutting and pasting in the auction, which was something to the effect of - I'm told its a fake, you should not assume otherwise. If you do, cancel your bid so we all don't have a headache in the morning.

 

Quite frankly, I don't know why people do what they do. If I did, I would make alot more money in this life.

 

However, I've known people like the seller (I had a good friend in college who would behave the exact same way -- although I don't know the seller at all and have no idea whom he or she is), so because of my college buddy, I do not find the seller's actions particularly suprising.

 

I find the real mystery to be the winning bidder. I'm wondering whether the art will surface again in the near future.

 

While I wasn't interested in paying, I'd sure like to know if it was real.

[Mister Trent]

I find the real mystery to be the winning bidder.

 

While I wasn't interested in paying, I'd sure like to know if it was real.

 

And I'm finding the real mystery is why a page from ASM # 35 is being marked as a page from ASM # 28.

 

What's your theory on that one, eh?