Romitaman response to everything going on recently

[MR SigS]

I don't want to leap in one direction or the other until they are filled in.

 

 

I admit that's a trait I wish I could master. There's a lot of unchecked passion in this topic.

[comix4fun]

I don't want to leap in one direction or the other until they are filled in.

 

 

I admit that's a trait I wish I could master. There's a lot of unchecked passion in this topic.

 

 

The simple issues are the ones that lend themselves to that. I jump on those and get emotional once I am sure.

 

The guy who buys a comic as one grade and then resells it as 2 grades up to make an extra buck. Easy call.

 

The guy who takes a cover, agreeing to pay, and then sells the cover on Ebay without ever paying a dime to the original owner. Easy peasy.

 

This thing? This monster of potential issues with little specificity? Eek.

[BCarter27]

Jan 19, 2016

Now..... its great see that some of our ASTUTE art [collectors] here on this website figured out that art on my website was also sold on heritage...or previously in a comic connect auction.....so I say congrats for figuring that out......however i've been doing this for over 14 YEARS.

 

i've given heritage over 2500 pieces of art over the years to auction off....

 

thanks

Mike

 

Feb 5, 2016

 .... I started buying art at heritage auctions 14 years ago ....But I started giving art to heritage in late 2014 to auction off......yet a lot of the early thread posts started coming out that I had been giving art to heritage to auction for 14 years.....(which is untrue)

 

Mike Burkey

 

 

 

[Funnyslover]

Just to clarify.

 

Jan 19, 2016

Now..... its great see that some of our ASTUTE art [collectors] here on this website figured out that art on my website was also sold on heritage...or previously in a comic connect auction.....so I say congrats for figuring that out......however i've been doing this for over 14 YEARS.

 

i've given heritage over 2500 pieces of art over the years to auction off....

 

thanks

Mike

 

Feb 5, 2016

 .... I started buying art at heritage auctions 14 years ago ....But I started giving art to heritage in late 2014 to auction off......yet a lot of the early thread posts started coming out that I had been giving art to heritage to auction for 14 years.....(which is untrue)

 

Mike Burkey

 

Either we can believe the 1st quote to be true and the 2nd to be a lie or misunderstanding, or the 1st quote is a typo or misunderstanding and the 2nd means MB is a selling machine, averaging over 100 pieces per month, every month, for no more than 25 months.

 

[BCarter27]

 

I love your post history. Lot of variety in there. Skin in the game?

[Shemp]

So Mike cleared the air that this hasn't been going on for 14 years. Is it better that he only shilled about a hundred or so pieces in the last 2 years?

 

[romitaman]

Just to clear the air.... both statements I made above are 100% correct.....

 

but I can also see how they can easily be taken out of context when both emails are compared together that were posted from different days........ and again I want to make it so its very clear....

 

I wrote previously:

 

"Now..... its great see that some of our ASTUTE art [collectors] here on this website figured out that art on my website was also sold on heritage...or previously in a comic connect auction.....so I say congrats for figuring that out......however i've been doing this for over 14 YEARS."

 

"ART ON MY WEBSITE WAS ALSO SOLD ON HERITAGE" is in reference to AFTER it was won from Heritage auctions I then put alot of it on my website to sell.....NOT BEFORE..... i've been doing this for 14 years..... and that's what I stated.

 

I never hid anything, and that's why in my first email I was surprised that it took 14 years for people to figure out that I bought art at auctions and then put them up on my website for sale....

 

PLEASE PLEASE don't tell me that it is now illegal and/or immoral to buy art at auction for resale................

 

I have won several hundreds of pieces from Heritage. Comiclink, and Comic Connect auctions from 2002 to present to put on my website....I stated this before and like I said earlier ....I typed my first posts very quickly and made a few mistakes in how they were written probably when broken down word for word...as some have done.

 

I can now see how those 2 posts could have been interpreted differently to some....and again... I'm sorry if my posts were not being as easy to understand as I'd have liked...

 

Also......In reference to someone who was asking about my art I'd given to Heritage....I did give Heritage not too long ago....... around 2000 pieces of my lowest valued art to auction...... With everything that's gone on recently..the remaining art is being sent back to me as it was agreed by both sides that this is the best way for bidders, sellers, and everyone going forward.

 

As I stated from the very beginning.....if anyone has any issues about anything with me or my business.....they can always call me on the phone privately and I'm happy to talk to them.

 

And I'll say this AGAIN..........I apologize if anything over the past few weeks hurt anyone in any way...I know some people will always think the worst of you no matter what you do or how you explain things......... and that's just part of life sometimes....But to all of the amazing comic art collectors i've dealt with and become friends with over the past 27 years up til this very day......... I do look forward to working very hard to helping each and every one of you to getting a lot more great art for your collections!

 

I'll try to have another great update in the near future with some great artwork!

 

Mike

[Mmehdy]

I have been out of town since the 27th.... but I wanted to get this out for everyone to read asap as I don't want this to keep lingering with the auctions coming up........ .

 

I was told by several people in the art community to not post at all.......but I believe in speaking about what transpired as I feel I owe it to the art collecting community, and I'm not one to hide, as everyone makes mistakes in life and you do your best to explain yourself and work it out the best way possible if you truly care about fixing a mistake....

 

When this first came out, I couldn't respond quickly because I was out of town.........I took a redeye flight home and the very first thIng I did when I got home was to get on my computer and post to clear the air before I went to bed...I probably should have proof read my words a little better, as it seems that everything I wrote in my first 2 posts were turned around to make me seem like I was smug and uncaring ......

 

As this thread grew and grew....Certain things I wrote were being taken out of context..

This grew to the point that some felt I was cheating good people.....

What happened with Heritage I shared openly.....and is seemed after a few days of posts that any future online debate by me against these claims would create hundreds more negative comments with not much fair debate so I kept from posting.

 

I told the entire collecting community they could email me privately or call me on the phone and I'd be happy to talk to ANYONE about this.....even my most hardened detractors......yet only 4 people chose to call me and we talked for over 30 minutes for each phone call and I appreciated and thanked every person for their calls.

 

 .... I started buying art at heritage auctions 14 years ago ....But I started giving art to heritage in late 2014 to auction off......yet a lot of the early thread posts started coming out that I had been giving art to heritage to auction for 14 years.....(which is untrue) .....and the snowball started growing to the point I've now been claimed to have manipulated every online art auction for 14 years..... and even eBay auctions......which again.... is 100% false....

 

..I've only given comiclink about10 or so pieces of art to my knowledge.... and all pieces were given over just the past few years......and all of them sold to whomever bought them and I don't know the winners....some I think I had reserves on them and got them back.......same with comic connect as Stephen Fishler shared on these posts....

 

In light of everything that has happened i do not want to be a distraction to the auction process as i feel it's fair for sellers AND the many buyers in The big auction houses to never have to wonder if the pieces they are selling or BUYING have questionable activities.......so I've talked with the heritage people very recently and we all agreed that all art that I did have with Heritage...(which was given to them in 2015) should be returned to me so all bidders and sellers feel the auction process is fair for everyone going forward.

 

   I want everyone reading this to know that there was no malice or intent ever to drive up any prices with any heritage bidders by my wanting to get certain pieces back that I had in auction....call it auction remorse if that makes more sense......but I wanted my pieces back and did it in a way that I thought was legal.....but clearly from all of the chat boards.....I made a very wrong choice in what I did as it was at the very least morally unfair to a lot of people in the collecting community.

 

I feel terrible for that.......I apologized before ....and I apologize again now for what happened. I take full responsibility for my actions as I never dreamed that what happened would hurt so many who have been friends and good customers of mine over the past 27 years.......... ..and the flame throwers afterward were an interesting read as well...and that is their right to voice their opinions....... But the bottom line is.....I never tried to deceive anyone or cheat anyone as that is not who I am and what I stand for......in life......as well as In our great hobby.

 

So I say again.......My apologies to anyone who feels they were affected in any way by what happened.....and I look forward to being the very best source possible going forward for everyone out there who is looking for some great Comic art for their collection going forward.......

 

Mike Burkey

 

Thank you for responding to the many speculations which have been put forth by the board. I believe I speak for at least a majority of the CGC members that feel that just saying 'Sorry" is simply not enough.

 

Mike, actions speak louder than words, you being a major art dealer for a large number of years, makes you actions accountable to a higher standard than say a regular art collector.

 

I proposed on this board,, on a couple of threads, a fair resolution in regards to your admission of your auction conduct. I also stated that when everybody gives and takes, it means it a good deal. I know a number of collectors who would want to be extreme in terms of restitution, but I hope calmer and sounder minds prevail.

 

SETTLEMENT:

 

1- That you donate to a non-profit comic book defense fund some art...a gesture which helps repair the damage done to comic collecting fandom. This is a good cause which benefits all. Again, actions speak louder than words.

 

2-As far as HA is concerned , while it appears from your statement that you will not being doing business with Ha for sometime in the future. Allow the underbidders and winners one free pass on one item for buyer premium. Just as a gesture...an act of good faith and restoring collector confidence. It is not a admission of wrong doing but simply good business.

 

Then we as a collecting community can move on...enjoy our hobby or investment happily ever after.

 

I have always believed in the good side of man, the ability of man to change and learn from his mistakes...I wish you luck in the future and hope everybody is made whole.

 

 

 

 

So I guess from the above response from MB all we are gonna get is "sorry" as this was not addressed be either him or ha.....

[MR SigS]

I wrote previously:

 

"Now..... its great see that some of our ASTUTE art [collectors] here on this website figured out that art on my website was also sold on heritage...or previously in a comic connect auction.....so I say congrats for figuring that out......however i've been doing this for over 14 YEARS."

 

"ART ON MY WEBSITE WAS ALSO SOLD ON HERITAGE" is in reference to AFTER it was won from Heritage auctions I then put alot of it on my website to sell.....NOT BEFORE..... i've been doing this for 14 years..... and that's what I stated.

 

I never hid anything, and that's why in my first email I was surprised that it took 14 years for people to figure out that I bought art at auctions and then put them up on my website for sale....

 

Thank you for addressing this

 

 

 

....I did give Heritage not too long ago....... around 2000 pieces of my lowest valued art to auction......

 

 

I apologize for my ignorance concerning the number of pieces you market at one time (or in a short time). Wow

[jbud73]

Well, I'm sure Mike's supporters will treat this as

 

His detractors will

 

That just is, what it is, however there are another group of people and these are the people that I'm interested in. I'm interested in the people that Mike's friends shilled, where they actually WON THE PIECE at Auction.

Those are the people that Mike, in the very least, owes an apology too.

 

Honestly Talk is pretty cheap these days. Someone wants to give you a pass, someone doesn't, The real indicator here is what the people who won 'shill reserve lots' think, because those are the people that were hurt by this.

 

Mike knows the lots he shilled that he didn't have to buy back.

 

Heritage knows the winners of those lots. I mean if Heritage is happy to contact under bidders on Mike's art when there has been 'user error' and as them if they want to buy the piece at their maximum bid, then I have to assume that they are happy to contact them and pass along a formal apology from the same consignor.

 

Anyone can say, 'they will take full responsibility for their actions,' but it only MEANS SOMETHING if they take FULL RESPONSIBILITY TO THE PARTIES THAT WERE HURT BY THOSE ACTIONS!!!!!!

[Buzzetta]

Exactly

 

 

And to tell the truth, I am not so embracing the damage control as far as character that is going on.

 

Once I hear someone start talking about the millions of dollars in sales that they do I think of their post in the voice of this guy... and no one wants to sound smug and condescending and sound like this guy.

 

[aokartman]

Hi jbud73,

I have to agree about the spin on the admissions, and I'm worried about the lack of response from HA. I have messaged them with no response. Much as I can forgive Mike, Heritage needs to step up and decide to change moving forward.

[Doc McCoy]

Since not everyone is still reading the original thread on this subject, this should be shared here as well since it delves into when & what pieces may have been allegedly shilled. Some amazing and comprehensive research done by jaybuck43.

 

Investigation into the Romitaman Shilling Situation.

 

Following Mike’s comments I, and several others urged for there to be a bit of calm and to slow the pitchforks down so that we can get a better understanding as to the facts and to what went on with regards to this entire situation. Over the past week I have delved through as much evidence as I could find. This involved looking at the history of HA original art auction results, Romitaman’s historical inventory (going as far back as 2002 in some cases), Romitaman’s eBay history and eBay sales. Attempting to get ComicLink information was not viable, as there website does not make this kind of information easily accessible. Given Comicconnet’s statement, there was no reason to look at Comicconnect auctioned art. I’ve tried to lay this out as cleanly as possible.

 

Scope

 

One of the initial questions that many people have had is how wide does this go? How many pieces have been shilled etc. I think many people seized on this line from Romitaman from his post “Now..... its great see that some of our ASTUTE art collators here on this website figured out that art on my website was also sold on heritage...or previously in a comic connect auction.....so I say congrats for figuring that out......however i've been doing this for over 14 YEARS.” http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9114012#Post9114012

It seems that many people interpreted that to mean that Romitaman had been selling on HA for 14 years and had been executing a scheme where he would consign to HA, get a friend to buy it, get the piece back and relist so as to set an artificial sale. The evidence does not bear this out. I looked at over 2,000 historical pieces Romitaman had owned. While some of them did appear at some time to have been auctioned off by HA, the older pieces did not appear in Romitaman’s inventory around any time prior to or after the auction. In some cases a piece would have been auctioned in 2007 and not show up in Romitaman’s inventory (ever) until 2014. Plenty of time for it to have been acquired legitimately in a sale or trade. The pieces that have the strongest evidence that they may have been shilled were auctioned by HA between November 2015 and January 2016. This includes both Sunday auctions and the Signature event. I had trouble finding anything that has strong evidence of the possibility of being shilled before November 2015. There of course exists the possibility that this has happened before, but it is not supported by the evidence I currently have.

 

What pieces were shilled?

 

I found extremely strong circumstantial proof that the following pieces were shilled by being bought back:

 

Giant-Size Man-Thing #4 Page 48 Listed on Romitaman as recently as October 4th 2015 https://web.archive.org/web/20151004101503/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=898&Ti=Frank+_Brunner

Sold on Heritage for November 20th 2015 for $4,541.00 http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/frank-brunner-giant-size-man-thing-4-page-48-original-art-marvel-1975-/a/7152-92036.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515

Listed back on Romitaman on 1/14/2016 for $6,000 http://www.romitaman.com/GalleryPiece.asp?Piece=19122&ArtistId=898

 

 

Warlock #6 Page 14. Listed on Romitaman as recently as June 5th 2015 for $500. https://web.archive.org/web/20150605024033/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=850&Order=title&view=all

Sold at Heritage December 6th 2015 for $358.50 http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/bob-brown-and-frank-giacoia-warlock-6-page-14-original-art-marvel-1973-/a/121549-11017.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

Relisted on Romitaman on January 14th 2016 for $500

http://www.romitaman.com/NewItems.asp

 

Warlock #7 Page 10. Listed on Romitaman as recently as June 5th 2015 for $250 https://web.archive.org/web/20150605024033/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=850&Order=title&view=all

Sold at Heritage November 29th 2015 for $286.80

http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/bob-brown-and-frank-giacoia-warlock-7-page-10-original-art-marvel-1973-/a/121548-15025.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

Relisted on Romitaman for $300 on January 14th 2016

http://www.romitaman.com/NewItems.asp

 

Fantastic Four 41 Page 11. On his site since at least August 9 2014 (furthest I can search back) at $14,000. Listed still for sale on September 9, 2015 https://web.archive.org/web/20150909233826/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=921&Ti=Jack_Kirby

"Sold" at auction in November 20 2015 for $13,145. http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/jack-kirby-and-vince-colletta-fantastic-four-41-page-11-medusa-and-the-thing-original-art-marvel-1965-/a/7152-92122.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

Listed back on Romitaman for $14,000 on 1/14/2016. http://www.romitaman.com/GalleryPiece.asp?Piece=18739&ArtistId=921

 

Batman 240 Page 8. On his site since September 2, 2013 (furthest I can search back) at $300. Listed as recently as Oct 4 2015

https://web.archive.org/web/20151004164507/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=1006&Ti=Rich+_Buckler

"Sold" at auction in November 29 2015 for $286.80. http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/rich-buckler-batman-240-theater-of-the-mind-page-8-original-art-dc-1972-/a/121548-15026.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

Listed back on Romitaman for $300 on 1/14/2016. http://www.romitaman.com/NewItems.asp

 

Captain America #6 page 21 On his site June 5th 2015 for $500. https://web.archive.org/web/20150605013102/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=1687&Ti=John+_Cassaday

and as recently as October 4, 2015 https://web.archive.org/web/20151004101934/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=1687&Ti=John+_Cassaday

"Sold" at auction for $478.00 in November 8 2015

http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/john-cassaday-captain-america-6-page-21-original-art-marvel-2002-/a/121545-12033.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

Listed back on Romitaman on 1/14 and is "On Hold". http://www.romitaman.com/NewItems.asp

 

Fantastic Four #334 Page 4. On his site since September 2 2013 listed for $350. https://web.archive.org/web/20130902025659/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=1006&Ti=Rich+_Buckler

On there as recently as October 4th 2015

https://web.archive.org/web/20151004164507/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=1006&Ti=Rich+_Buckler

"Sold" at auction for $113.53 on December 20th 2015. http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/rich-buckler-and-romeo-tanghal-fantastic-four-334-page-4-original-art-marvel-1989-/a/121551-13014.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

Listed back on Romitaman for $350 on 1/14.

http://www.romitaman.com/newitems.asp

 

Giant-Size Master of Kung Fu #1 Page 39. On his site since August 9th 2014,listed for $550.

https://web.archive.org/web/20140809151845/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=1089&Ti=P%2E+Craig_Russell

On there as recently as October 4 2015

https://web.archive.org/web/20150605031305/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=1089&Ti=P.+Craig_Russell

"Sold" at auction for 358.50 on November 15 2015.

http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/p-craig-russell-giant-size-master-of-kung-fu-1-page-39-original-art-marvel-1974-/a/121546-13108.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

Listed back on Romitaman for $500.

http://www.romitaman.com/newitems.asp

 

Kalla Dreadstar / Vanth Dreadstar Large Mixed Media Promo Poster Art. On his site for $350 Since at least September 29 2013. https://web.archive.org/web/20130929194314/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=1158&Ti=Ernie_Colon

Listed as recently as October 4th 2015 https://web.archive.org/web/20151004102606/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=1158&Ti=Ernie_Colon

Sells at HA for $191.20 on Dec 13, 2015

http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/ernie-colon-jim-starlin-s-dreadstar-illustration-original-art-malibu-bravura-1994-/a/121550-12036.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

Listed for $350 on Romitaman on 01/14/2016.

http://www.romitaman.com/newitems.asp

 

I’m suspicious about the following pieces. They were all owned by Romitaman during the time period, all hit on Heritage for around their list price on Romitaman. However none of them have been relisted. This however makes sense since most of these auctions took place after January 1 and Romitaman has not done a website update since January 14th. Of course the possibility exists that I am wrong about any one or even all of the following pieces.

 

**The Avengers #115 Page 12 Listed on Romitaman on 09/30 for $400. https://web.archive.org/web/20151004102817/http://www.romitaman.com/NewItems.asp?Page=1&Order=date

Sold on HA on January 31 2016 for $382.40 http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/bob-brown-and-mike-esposito-the-avengers-115-page-12-original-art-marvel-1973-/a/121605-15013.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

 

**The Avengers #115 Page 22. Listed on Romitaman on 09/30 for $500,

https://web.archive.org/web/20151004102817/http://www.romitaman.com/NewItems.asp?Page=1&Order=date

Sold on HA for $525.80 on January 31, 2016.

http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/bob-brown-and-mike-esposito-the-avengers-115-page-22-original-art-marvel-1973-/a/121605-15014.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

 

**Batman 248 Page 12 Listed on Romitaman on 09/30 for $450 https://web.archive.org/web/20151004102817/http://www.romitaman.com/NewItems.asp?Page=1&Order=date

Sold on HA on January 10, 2016 for $478

http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/bob-brown-and--giordano-batman-248-page-12-original-art-dc-1973-/a/121602-12013.s?ic4=GalleryView-Thumbnail-071515

 

 

**Detective Comics #415 Page 7 listed on Romitaman as recently as June 5th 2015 $400, https://web.archive.org/web/20150605024043/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=850&Page=2&Order=title

Sold on HA for $286.80 on January 3, 2016

http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/bob-brown-and--giordano-detective-comics-415-page-7-original-art-dc-1971-/a/121601-11014.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

 

 

**Detective Comics #428 Page 6 Listed on romitaman As recently as June 5 2015 $400 https://web.archive.org/web/20150605024043/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=850&Page=2&Order=title

Sold on HA for $244.98 on January 24 2016

http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/bob-brown-and--giordano-detective-comics-428-page-6-original-art-dc-1972-/a/121604-14017.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

 

** Iron Man #183 Page 22 listed on Romitaman as recently as October 4th 2015 for $200, https://web.archive.org/web/20151004162659/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=1253&Ti=Luke_McDonnell

Sold on HA for $119.50 on December 20 2015

http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/luke-mcdonnell-and-steve-mitchell-iron-man-183-story-page-22-original-art-marvel-1984-/a/121551-13061.s?ic4=GalleryView-Thumbnail-071515

 

**Marvel Team Up #111 Page 5. Most recently listed n Romitaman on October 4th 2015 for $450.

https://web.archive.org/web/20151004063308/http://www.romitaman.com/ArtistGalleryRoom.asp?ArtistId=913&Ti=Herb+_Trimpe

Sold on HA for $358 on January 3 2016 http://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/herb-trimpe-and-mike-esposito-marvel-team-up-111-story-page-5-original-art-marvel-1981-/a/121601-11120.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

 

 

This is a total of 16 pieces, assuming all of the suspect pieces were in fact shilled. There are also 4 additional pieces that are highly suspect but no proof currently exists, as it looks like they may have been removed from the site. These were brought up prior to Romitaman’s admission, by several boardies.

 

Iron Man Annual #3 Page 45

Tales to Astonish #79 Sub-Mariner Page 11

TALES TO ASTONISH Issue #96

Detective #430 Page 7

 

That brings the total suspected to 20.

 

 

This covers the pages that were reacquired by Romitaman. Sadly, there is no way of definitively knowing what pages that were consigned by Romitaman hit their hidden reserve and then were sold to a bona fide purchaser who thought that they were bidding against another person, not someone bidding to get it at or under Romitaman’s hidden reserve and then return to him in trade.

 

Market Manipulation

 

Based on looking at the over 2,000 listings, and the very small number of listings found (comparatively) in auction sites, I do not think that Romitaman was attempting to manipulate the market in the way that has been described.

 

The allegation seems to be that Romitaman purposefully had people bid up the cost of pages to either sell them at a higher price, or to create a fictitious sale to give potential future buyers a comp to use to gauge future prices. He would need many more listings to accomplish that goal. Given the size and scope of the original art marketplace, it is unlikely that such a small sampling over a short period of time (from November 2015) would have a drastic impact and fluctuate the market that much.

 

Regardless of his intent, a small part of the market was manipulated though. Individuals were incentivized to bid up the price of items to hit a hidden reserve with the offer of trade + covering the BP. There are at least 20 pieces that exist that should have ended with a different owner, at a lower price.

 

And other threads that have resurfaced in the last few weeks show that Romitaman’s hands are not clean. That he has in the past attempted to show a sale having occurred, that had not in fact occurred, thus putting confidence in a piece that such a high sale price could again occur.

 

Heritage Auction’s Stance

 

Following all of the other findings, it was necessary to contact Heritage and see what their stance was on the whole issue. I called on February 4th. I spoke with Jerry and asked what the position was regarding the Romitaman situation. He stated that he had thought that Heritage had released an official statement on this, but was willing to speak with me about it. He said that since Mike had not broken any laws, there was no issue with the situation. When I followed up and asked if they (heritage) had no issue with the fact that Mike had contacted and asked people to bid on his pieces, Jerry stated that it is fine, because only the consignor is prohibited from bidding on their piece. If Mike or any seller wants to contact a friend and arrange for them to acquire a piece and then get it back to the original owner, that is not Heritage’s problem. I followed this up by asking if Heritage does anything to check if the buyer is actually paying for the piece, or if a seller could pay for a piece through another users account. This is when Jerry got very upset. His response was No we don’t, you want us to check our 900,000 clients over 40 categories to see if someone else is paying for them. It was at this point that I said thank you and hung up. The take away is that Heritage does not do anything to check for outside arrangements such as shilling. They only check that the seller is not bidding on the piece with his account.

 

TL;DR Version:

Strong circumstantial evidence exists to show that Romitaman probably shilled at least 20 auctions, and there is no way to tell how many additional auctions were shilled that a Bona Fide Purchaser got the piece at an inflated price (because of bidders bidding to a hidden reserve) Heritage does not care if bidders use shill accounts, they only care if the seller of the piece bids on the piece. They do not take any precautions to check if a seller has worked out a deal with the buyer, including not checking if the seller pays for the buyers win.

[tv horror]

That was a very intelligent piece of work Jaybuck, I enjoyed reading this more than all those that are quoting shill after shill or the infamous see 15. It looks very like he has been setting the bar for his bids and the only loser is the poor fool parting with his hard earned money. Thanks again for taking the time to explain, it also begs the question how must are the art pages or collections really worth.

[AnkurJ]

Mike,

Now that what's done is done, can you provide s list of pieces this was done with?

Ankur

[theflashunc]

What I have issue with isn't the particular paragraph in your original post in a vacuum. Rather, its this passage in full:

 

NOW......What everyone is speculating about and giving their non facts about......If I give them a piece of art that I feel is worth "X" dollars (ALL at no reserve..... ) and I see that my art I gave them coming up at auction at way less than the "X" dollars I feel its worth..... I will ask any collector I know to buy it and I will work out whatever trade or cash / trade deal I have to do for them to get that piece back if it sells for well below what "I FEEL" is market value, , and I'm happy to put it back on my website and pay the 19.5% heritage premium on top of the deal I do with the collector.

 

that is not bad business..... its called Being smart and knowing your art market enough to know what YOU feel something truly is worth when others do not.

 

in my latest Romitaman website update on January 14th on my website I put up 10 or so pieces of art which were from the MOST RECENT November heritage and Comic connect auctions that I owned for several years ....(.I felt the prices were low enough that I worked a deal with another collector to get them back because I felt they were very undervalued so we did a deal and I put them back on my website for sale on January 14th......... and in less than 5 days "7" of the pieces I had for YEARS on my website without sales now SOLD last week....so how is that bad business?

 

I usually lower the prices a little also from their previous listed prices from years ago when I put the art back up for sale.....it certainly costs me "alot of money" and art to do this but its worth it for me in the long run as it actually helps "ME" get a better feel for how strong or non strong parts of comic art market is also.

 

Now..... its great see that some of our ASTUTE art collators here on this website figured out that art on my website was also sold on heritage...or previously in a comic connect auction.....so I say congrats for figuring that out......however i've been doing this for over 14 YEARS.

 

i've given heritage over 2500 pieces of art over the years to auction off.... and i've worked out numerous deals with other collectors to get a hundred or so back if I felt the prices at auction were undervalued and I could sell it for more on my website in the future if I just give it time......

 

I'm still having trouble squaring the circle, as each successive post seems to bring up more questions than answers.

 

 

[miraclemet]

When Mike says that he's pulled all of the other 2000 pieces of art back from HA (minus the ones that actually "sold" to bidders that were not Mike's shills) as a response to this outrage/scandal I don't buy it.

 

I think he's seen the market for those pieces (or rather seen how much shilling is needed) and would rather hold the un-auctioned OA rather than to have to live with a market determined value for the pages where the auctions went off under the shill-focused eye of the consumers here (or if HA actually held someone accountable for shilling). Also considering his vast inventory, Im sure he's aware that if those 2000 pages revealed a lesser general market value for OA, then it would have a negative effect on his remaining inventories value.

 

For the pages that DID sell before the pull out...

 

• I would love to know the % of pages he won back by being the high bidder.
  
• I would love to know the % of pages that sold with zero shilling (which I assume means they met his market hopes)
  
• I would love to know the % of pages that sold with shilling (and what price they would have realized when you remove the shill bids).

 

My assumption (and HOPE) is that very few pages went to new owners once he started shilling his listings.

 

If as he says...

I never tried to deceive anyone or cheat anyone as that is not who I am and what I stand for......in life......as well as In our great hobby.

I can only assume that means that no pages that were shilled went to new owners, because even one shill bid that resulted in someone paying more would constitute cheating someone.

 

My guess is that there were almost no pages that went to new owners without shilling (just based on the general impression that Mike was not happy with how the market was reacting to his listings and final prices), but I'll let Mike say whether that's accurate or not.

 

you wrote...

I want everyone reading this to know that there was no malice or intent ever to drive up any prices with any heritage bidders by my wanting to get certain pieces back that I had in auction....call it auction remorse if that makes more sense......

I also don't get the act of "auction remorse" (more commonly referred to as sellers remorse) for a dealer who then goes and re-lists the re-won pages as for sale on his site (based on jaybucks post). I know listing the book isn't the same as selling the book, but if you put it out there, it COULD be bought, so how does that reconcile with his remorse? Unless the sellers remorse was just tied to the realized price at auction...To me that is completely an effort to maintain your perceived market prices (especially considering that you still had and have a big stake in the OA market). I also think you are either splitting hairs or fooling yourself with the "drive up prices" choice of words. Do you rationalize shill bidding lots up to your acceptable market value as driving up prices, or just price enforcing (its the same thing).

 

I find the bending over backwards by some people to be a mix of "benefit of the doubt", "fairness" (both of which are laudable) and some "this guy has lots of great product and I want to be on his good side in case we do a deal in the future" (see there's that pessimist in me creeping in!)

 

if anyone has any issues about anything with me or my business.....they can always call me on the phone privately and I'm happy to talk to them.

yeah, cause doing things behind the scene has worked out so well so far...

 

I think the question posed to romitaman earlier stands still for an answer to be made:

 

Will you contact (via HA) those who won your shilled listings and refund them the difference between their final top bid, and their final top bid minus shilling?

 

And if your response is "well that's difficult to tell for sure because of multiple bidders and such..." then why is it ok to cloud the market IN your favor, but not to have a clouded market be in in THEIR favor. They (the bidders) certainly bid in good faith, thinking they were bidding against others in the market, not against the owner/owner's shills. If it's that important use the reserve function, except you and I know that the reserve function has its own negative impact on bidding, and you want both your cake and to eat it too...

 

Mike I love your passion for this part of the hobby, and think your collection and your business are a key part of the OA world, but on this front you were just plain wrong.

 

sorry if this post is full of assuming the worst, that's just the pessimist in me.

[Kevin76]

Why not just put a reserve on the auctions if you couldn't afford to let them go below expectations, rather than having someone shill for you? Or just either keep them listed on your own site or eBay as a BIN?

 

Reputations can take many years to build and can be destroyed overnight.

[pinupcartoonguy]

Why not just put a reserve on the auctions if you couldn't afford to let them go below expectations, rather than having someone shill for you? Or just either keep them listed on your own site or eBay as a BIN?

 

Reputations can take many years to build and can be destroyed overnight.

 

If you put a reserve, the seller's premium is higher.

[Mmehdy]

If you put a reserve some people consider less buyer interest and less likely that a emotional biddder will come on board also