Nostalgia? Nope, none here. 2 2

[ParamagicFF]

On 4/24/2017 at 10:47 AM, SquareChaos said:

I have to assume there is a correlation to whether or not people are still reading new comics, and how much they're willing to put into the pursuit of nostalgic art.

Definitely. I know when commissioning an artist my favorite current books/longtime favorite books I'm still reading compete for the subject matter. After Marvel completely soured Spiderman for me I no longer request him, or really have as much interest in those pieces.

[delekkerste]

12 hours ago, tth2 said:

That's such a stretch.  Based on that reasoning, the most important factor in my collecting anything is not nostalgia, but my parents, because if they hadn't met and had me, then I wouldn't have been born and thus would never had any interest in collecting.  Or maybe it's my grandparents, because if they hadn't met and had my parents...

So actually, it all comes down to Genetic Eve.

I dunno...according to a prominent Hong Kong-based comic/OA collector profiled in Heritage Magazine for the Intelligent Collector last year, "It's simply about great art, characters and holding on to your childhood."  

So, I'm going to take his words at face value and say that it really IS about nostalgia (at least in an oblique/derivative sense), and not about one's parents, grandparents, Genetic Eve or the primordial ooze. 

[comicwiz]

Collecting is generally about buying into memories. I can see it being possible to develop a fondness for a particular artistic style, aethetic, influence or history as this is a form of art introduced through the comic medium and storytelling.

I can see why people gravitate to certain artists based on the aesthetic. I can also see people buying OA for decorative reasons. A secondary motivation of mine is an appreciation for the process of creating a comic, but I had a PM with someone not too long ago about a piece and offered a cash/trade deal involving some key comics, and they sounded like they literally knew nothing or ever heard about comics from their response. Even if you're not buying for memories or nostalgia, how can anyone pursue collecting comic art without some baseline introduction or experience in reading comics at some earlier point in their life? I'm sorry, I just don't understand that and probably never will.

Beyond these observations in collecting OA, storytelling and characters are the primary reasons that brought me to the point where I'm at in my pursuits. I can understand why the market evolved to breaking up stories and selling individual pages, but that is something incongruent to what I find most enjoyable about OA.  I like to watch how the artist paced the story, it's progression, and flow. I realize some artists do a better job of storytelling through splash pages and covers than others, but I'd rather collect dailies or Saturday/Sunday pages as standalone pages.

Edited April 26, 2017 by comicwiz

[vodou]

1 hour ago, delekkerste said:

I dunno...according to a prominent Hong Kong-based comic/OA collector profiled in Heritage Magazine for the Intelligent Collector last year, "It's simply about great art, characters and holding on to your childhood."  

So, I'm going to take his words at face value and say that it really IS about nostalgia (at least in an oblique/derivative sense), and not about one's parents, grandparents, Genetic Eve or the primordial ooze. 

Eh I don't think so. More like - "It's simply about holding on to your childhood, characters (from childhood) and (only by accident, occasionally) great art."

I've been spending a little more time lately looking at newer books/art/artists, say the last 10-15 years of product. The list Felix sent me to helped a bit along with opening my mind up a bit to possibilities...The average quality of art has risen a lot over the past. I can write this without the crutch of nostalgia to lean on. Not just pretty pin-ups but really nice sequential storytelling. It's actually good art. Decompressed storytelling...not a fan of sugar-free comics, but that's what they're giving us today and anyway, I can always pick up an actual book if that's what I really want. I can't say "actually good art" about most of twentieth century comic art, stripped of nostalgia and nostalgic trappings (that which Eric and others allude to).

Nostalgic trappings...I think we should all be careful how quickly we jump on the bandwagon here because Tim (tth2) does have a point, if we invalidate all non-nostalgia as non-existent simply because everything we like today is a product of our lifetime experiences to date (duh)...we are saying absolutely nothing at all. The sky is blue too. And so..?

Being "into" non-nostalgic art is no particular badge of honor (imo) but it is a valid thing to talk about and differentiate one collector's desires (Give Me ALL THE SPIDEY ART!!!) from another's (no thanks I collect Illustration Art, ya know..."real" art!), with all the shades of gray in between that a largish population can produce. Not to mention Haitian Vodou (heh).

I could play Devil's Advocate all over the place on this subject, but personally I was lucky enough to get "into" comic art at a time when my nostalgia material was still pretty cheap, and I happened to be of a mindset to imprudently and vastly over-allocate my resources to it. Having done that, cheap 'n deep, I just don't find myself slavishly having to click BID! every time a Cockrum X-Men page hits the block (for example) and instead have that much more time (and space in my brain) to look at all the other art the world has to offer. Not to say I don't still click BID!, sure I do, but I'm also very much as peace with the collection I had ten years ago, (from which I've sold nothing out of), not to mention what's been added since purely as opportunity arose. I'm lucky and I know it, but also blessed that I do have the time/brainspace to look at the other stuff, some of it is really good too and so much there to be discovered as there's little/no context already in place...(nearly) uncharted territory! I wish everybody could experience that, sort of like that day we each first discovered that comic OA existed and some of the stuff we really dug was (oh-holy-jeesus!!!) affordable! This happens to me almost once a week. I devour new (to me) art and artists on a daily basis and find genius often. It's just typically not comic art, and definitely not vintage character-driven comic art.

Haven't bought anything through Felix yet, and I may never...the feeding frenzy for the good stuff...I'm getting a little old for that...but I've been picking up some other stuff here and there and I do like it. New art, the stuff the kids like...it does keep you young

[NelsonAI]

My nostalgia is for the character, not necessarily the specific issues of comics I read as a kid.  You can still quench your thirst for nostalgia by collecting a piece of art from the modern era that is within your budget.  I get just as much joy from looking at an affordable Spidey cover by Patrick Scherberger or Captain America art by Steve Epting.  The quality of their art IMHO is better than many from earlier eras.   The art speaks for itself.

Just because the art is old, doesn't automatically mean it should be more desirable.  I do not find myself chasing after art with Spider-Man battling the Rocket Racer drawn by Ross Andru and Frank Giacoa.

Cheers!

N.

 

[zhamlau]

12 hours ago, buyatari said:

We are buying ink drawings of costumed superheroes for 3,4, 5, and some of us even 6 figures. 

Nostalgia for the genre isn't a factor? 

When I say that out loud, it blows my mind. I bought an AF15 in higher grade recently...again mind blown when i pull myself out of collector mode and into "omg, how many months of mortgage payments did i put into this collection of staples and paper?!?!"

I keep waiting for this ride to end and crash so i can buy art and comics for 10cents on the previous dollar...it keeps not happening for some reason. God, how great would it be if everyone agreed to start selling covers for few hundred bucks again (in today's dollars)!

 

 

Edited April 26, 2017 by zhamlau
spellinz 'n whutnot

[tth2]

5 hours ago, delekkerste said:

18 hours ago, tth2 said:

That's such a stretch.  Based on that reasoning, the most important factor in my collecting anything is not nostalgia, but my parents, because if they hadn't met and had me, then I wouldn't have been born and thus would never had any interest in collecting.  Or maybe it's my grandparents, because if they hadn't met and had my parents...

So actually, it all comes down to Genetic Eve.

I dunno...according to a prominent Hong Kong-based comic/OA collector profiled in Heritage Magazine for the Intelligent Collector last year, "It's simply about great art, characters and holding on to your childhood."  

So, I'm going to take his words at face value and say that it really IS about nostalgia (at least in an oblique/derivative sense), and not about one's parents, grandparents, Genetic Eve or the primordial ooze. 

 Sure, that's why I collect, but it's not the only reason why people collect, and might not be the most important reason for many of them.  I think some people who were not comic readers in grade school do get into it later in life.

Anyways, the implication of your hypothesis is that collecting comics/art is not very sophisticated because we do it primarily because of nostalgia, as opposed to collecting fine art which is based purely on aesthetic appreciation.  But it's really not a fair comparison since few 7 year olds are able to collect Impressionist paintings, even if they could appreciate them.

[Bird]

8 minutes ago, tth2 said:

Anyways, the implication of your hypothesis is that collecting comics/art is not very sophisticated because we do it primarily because of nostalgia, as opposed to collecting fine art which is based purely on aesthetic appreciation.  But it's really not a fair comparison since few 7 year olds are able to collect Impressionist paintings, even if they could appreciate them.

I myself think that an adult making a conscious choice to satisfy a desire to own something based purely on aesthetics is no more or less valid than satisfying a desire to own something nostalgic. They are different but not greater or lesser, just different. (As far as "sophisticated" I cannot really speak to that, but it seems a value judgment that I myself wouldn't make. To each his own. Again, as long as it is a conscious process. )

[Flambit]

1 hour ago, zhamlau said:

When I say that out loud, it blows my mind. I bought an AF15 in higher grade recently...again mind blown when i pull myself out of collector mode and into "omg, how many months of mortgage payments did i put into this collection of staples and paper?!?!"

I keep waiting for this ride to end and crash so i can buy art and comics for 10cents on the previous dollar...it keeps not happening for some reason. God, how great would it be if everyone agreed to start selling covers for few hundred bucks again (in today's dollars)!

 

 

I was flipping through the Heritage archives, and I'd be happy just to go back to 2011-2012 prices!

[vaillant]

Nostalgia (as you explained it) is very important, I would say essential in some cases (but it has to be understood in a larger sense, not just of "personal memories").
The point to me is that this kind of nostalgia is not enough: the passion for collecting and for a genuine interest raises from a number of factors, and criticism (good comics criticism) is equally important.