Marvel Decides Who The Real Fans Are At C2E2 – No Window Bags For Comics Signatures! 5 5

[jcjames]

21 minutes ago, Designer Toast said:

 Remember when Amanda Conner did a free sketch for someone and she found out it was being sold on eBay?  Yep, no more free sketches for the fans thanks to some greedy tool bag who probably gushed what a fan they were and had the book on eBay fifteen minutes later...

I don't get why an artist would care if one of their customers/fans sells a "free" (how much did he pay to get in to see her?) sketch she did.

Does she feel that SHE should get a cut of his profit? Does she feel cheated out of being able to earn money selling her sketches on Ebay? If so, then she can crank out a dozen quick sketches on a Saturday morning for herself and sell them on the bay any time she wants. So she doesn't want people making money off of her "free" sketches... but she has no problem RECEIVING a cut of their money that they pay just to get in to see her.

If you GIVE something to someone, it is now THEIRS and so why get all upset if they sell it? She's getting paid to be there, and he is paying to meet her so some of HIS money ends up in HER pocket, so yeah - he DID pay her for the sketch - so what's the problem? Did she not get paid enough? Hmm... I know her time and talent has value, but she must be the most naive person to think that everyone who gets a "free" sketch of hers will keep it forever and no one would ever sell it.

YMMV

 

Edited April 24, 2017 by jcjames

[Thwipped]

Meh, went to a convention not to long ago and seen it done twenty different ways from twenty different tables. 

The one that bothered me was the ONE person I was there to see was not allowing CGC or any COA's to be done at his table. 

When I was at home discussing this with my wife, she put it all in perspective. 

She said, "So, who cares if you can get it 'properly graded, you got his autograph and that is all you really cared about."

She is right. As a fan, I'm not planning on selling my books.  They are my personal collection. So getting them witnessed and graded is not SO important. 

In the context of the post, I think this applies. "Marvel" or whoever doesn't want to saturate the market with speculators. Serves them right to not want that to happen. Was anyone alive in the 1990's? Better question, was anyone collecting comics in the 1990's? I was, it was horrendous. Every other book was a brand new #1 or death or resurrection, and the covers...god, the covers. You had your die-cut, chromium, hologram, colorform, etc. 

The point is, Marvel went bankrupt because of speculation. They have been there and seen it. Also, listen to my wife, she's a smart bird. You got your signature, you met your hero. 

[fmaz]

First of all, I support Lauren's take on anything.. she's awesome.

But secondly, what this immediately reminded me of was the same issue in the sports world.  Any fellow baseball fans out there?  Baseball players who sign before games LOVE signing for the kids who come down to the front row during batting practice, but you can see their eyes go dead when an older guy pulls out a professional binder of cards, or a bat out of a case, etc... something that is clearly being signed in order to be sold. 

The thing is? There's nothing you can do about that.  Because even little kids who get cards signed bring them in card sleeves wanting to keep them from getting all beat up... and there ARE older fans who might just collect signed cards or bats, or whatever and have no intention whatsoever of selling them. 

So the system that baseball, and most pro sports has worked out is this - if you get them at the game, it's free.  But there are also "signing events" throughout the year at card shows,  shops, etc, and at those, EVERYONE pays, even little freckle faced six-year old Timmy who just wants his ball signed.

The difference between how pro sports has handled it and his ham-handed Marvel rep has done it, is at no time has anyone with MLB, NFL, NBA or the NHL announced a criteria for "real fans."  My God, was THAT a grade-A stupid thing to say.

The worst part is that I think that, at its heart, this was Marvel was TRYING to do something nice by "standing up for the 'real' fans." It was just incredibly ill-conceived and without any basis in reality.   Other than that?  Well done!! 

Edited April 24, 2017 by fmaz

[shadroch]

I imagine the Marvel employee was some low level production guy or maybe even an intern, ordered to do a job they weren't properly prepared for. Don't take the words of some underling and make them into Marvels policy.

[Ryan.]

[Transplant]

Sadfan is sad. 

[Lucky Baru]

12 hours ago, shadroch said:

how long until Marvel starts selling exclusive Signature Series covers.  Why pass all that revenue to third and fourth party vendors.

Charge $50, split it with the artist and limit it to preorders.

I'm so so glad I'm off the bus.

 

If they did a signature variant that only has artwork for it alone it would be an excellent marketing idea. 

[Turtle]

8 hours ago, jcjames said:

I don't get why an artist would care if one of their customers/fans sells a "free" (how much did he pay to get in to see her?) sketch she did.

Does she feel that SHE should get a cut of his profit? Does she feel cheated out of being able to earn money selling her sketches on Ebay? If so, then she can crank out a dozen quick sketches on a Saturday morning for herself and sell them on the bay any time she wants. So she doesn't want people making money off of her "free" sketches... but she has no problem RECEIVING a cut of their money that they pay just to get in to see her.

If you GIVE something to someone, it is now THEIRS and so why get all upset if they sell it? She's getting paid to be there, and he is paying to meet her so some of HIS money ends up in HER pocket, so yeah - he DID pay her for the sketch - so what's the problem? Did she not get paid enough? Hmm... I know her time and talent has value, but she must be the most naive person to think that everyone who gets a "free" sketch of hers will keep it forever and no one would ever sell it.

YMMV

 

If the fan approached the artist and politely asked for a sketch and the artist obliges, then I'd say your point is a valid one. 

However, sometimes people get a little pushy/beggy when asking for things from creators at shows, sometimes lying and saying "I'm your biggest fan", "I've been trying to get one from you forever", "I want to pass this on to my kid", etc., etc., etc. when they really have no intention of keeping the item long term.  From a legal standpoint, the two scenarios are the same.  A person convinced an artist to draw a free sketch at a convention.  From an ethical standpoint?  Very questionable.

This happened pretty publicly with Adam Hughes a few years back.  Someone approached Adam Hughes for a commission at a show.  In the past, Adam took a list at the beginning of the show and picked which commissions from the list to do based on his own personal leanings (person asking, subject requested, etc.) and he only got to a small handful during each show.  Someone at this show got on his list and proceeded to tell Adam that he was his #1 fan and that he'd be trying to get a commission from him for years...practically begging Adam to pick his request.  Adam decides to make this fan super happy and does the commission.  As I recall, by the time the show had closed, the piece was already listed on ebay, and it didn't take long to come to Adam's attention.  Adam posted about this negative experience and stated that he would no longer be doing commissions at shows using his old list method.  For some time after that, the only commissions he'd do were the ones he sold on ebay in the days leading up to the show (which sold for multiples of what he charged for commissions at shows).  This was a few years back and I'm not sure what his current commission policy is. 

All I'm saying is that I agree, some artists care a little too much about what happens to something they sign/draw once it leaves their table.  However, obtaining that something from a creator under false pretenses is highly unethical to me and would shift how I view the situation.

[Fan Boy]

All these remarks aside, what I want to know is ... what is the deal with blue tape around the book in the bag? That method escapes me as I can't see why its purpose is for? 

on the topic, what Marvel had done was not good way to respond to the fans from their side. But I do kind of see their point in there. Not me, as I am more of a fan to certain books based on whom did the artwork or wrote good scripts for stories. I go by the creator or writer. Not by company that did the printing in publishing!  

[1Cool]

I'd not even think to ask for a free sketch from an artist unless I am at least buying a print from them.  They are there to make money or it is a waste of a weekend that they could be doing something else.  I equate it to someone walking up to a comic booth and asking for a free comic without buying anything. 

[1Cool]

1 minute ago, Fan Boy said:

All these remarks aside, what I want to know is ... what is the deal with blue tape around the book in the bag? That method escapes me as I can't see why its purpose is for? 

on the topic, what Marvel had done was not good way to respond to the fans from their side. But I do kind of see their point in there. Not me, as I am more of a fan to certain books based on whom did the artwork or wrote good scripts for stories. I go by the creator or writer. Not by company that did the printing in publishing!  

The blue tape outlines the hole that has been cut in the bag.  This helps to protect the spine (or in some cases most of the book) and let the artist know where you want them to sign the book. 

[Fan Boy]

1 minute ago, 1Cool said:

The blue tape outlines the hole that has been cut in the bag.  This helps to protect the spine (or in some cases most of the book) and let the artist know where you want them to sign the book. 

So let me get you right if I am reading correct.  The bag had the centre cut out, then reseal cut lines with blue tape. Book goes in the bag.  Blue tape is meant to be remove to unseal the centre piece for the artist/writer to sign on the book. After that, it is closed retaped again. Have I got that right?

Thanks

[Bird]

3 minutes ago, Fan Boy said:

So let me get you right if I am reading correct.  The bag had the centre cut out, then reseal cut lines with blue tape. Book goes in the bag.  Blue tape is meant to be remove to unseal the centre piece for the artist/writer to sign on the book. After that, it is closed retaped again. Have I got that right?

Thanks

no, not at all. Blue tape just stregthens the edges of the now cut plastic and clarifies where the signer should sign. The area "inside" the tape is now exposed (and the whole thing is likely placed into another bag before and after the signing).

[W16227]

7 minutes ago, Fan Boy said:

All these remarks aside, what I want to know is ... what is the deal with blue tape around the book in the bag? That method escapes me as I can't see why its purpose is for? 

on the topic, what Marvel had done was not good way to respond to the fans from their side. But I do kind of see their point in there. Not me, as I am more of a fan to certain books based on whom did the artwork or wrote good scripts for stories. I go by the creator or writer. Not by company that did the printing in publishing!  

 

I use blue tape ( painters tape)  - for interior packaging when I ship.  It has a very low release point - so much lower chance of an accidental tape pull if someone is rushing to unbox the package.

From the picture - it looks like they are protecting the edges of the bag with this - so making the window somewhat stronger to prevent pulling.   I would not recommend putting right on the book.  I did test the tape on some modern books - did not appear to do any damage, but the adhesive on my "blue" ( 3m painters tape) - does change a little over time. Plus - with a modern you are really hoping for that 9.8 so I would not really want anything to touch the book.......

 

[Fan Boy]

1 minute ago, Bird said:

no, not at all. Blue tape just stregthens the edges of the now cut plastic and clarifies where the signer should sign. The area "inside" the tape is now exposed (and the whole thing is likely placed into another bag before and after the signing).

Ahh, now I get it. Thanks for the explanation. 

[1Cool]

The blue tape is fairly sturdy and it is easy to see when a lot of books are being signed in a row and you may change the optimal location you want the artist to sign.  And you can write on it to help novice artists.

[TheRealVenom]

Bleeding cool  did not read....

[Fan Boy]

Hm, that means there are a lot of plastic comic bags with cut out holes in various (where to sign by specific) spots by folks everywhere all around! 

Before we know that, there will be someone to come up a new market to sell Blue-Taped cut out comic bags in bulk!   "Do you want one pack of 100 left-corner or right-corner cut out hole modern bags, sir?" I can see a dealer saying that.  

[Foolkiller]

First of all, I think that Sig Series (even though I don't personally collect it) is great, and an opportunity for artists, reps and dealers to all make money.  Even the publisher does by offering "blank" covers, variants etc. -- all these things can help drive sales and folks wanting to buy more books.  

There are artists and folks who feel that monetizing their signature or sketches feels unfair, but if they are being compensated, it's just another part of the business.  

Someone above analogized it to athletes.  These are folks who are paid millions of dollars to play the game and are supported by fans.  I think it certainly gives them more joy to sign for a kid rather than someone who is just processing signatures for profit.  When I travel I'm often in hotels where visiting sports teams (frequently NBA or NHL) players are staying.  Every time I enter or leave the hotel, there are a small group of adults (I recognize some of them because they're always the same folks) waiting to get autographs, clearly sports memorabilia professionals.  Now this is how they make their living, but some of them are just sullen.  Perhaps they're jaded etc.  I rode up in the elevator one time with one of the athletes as he was coming in and blew by the autograph hounds and asked him out of curiosity his attitude about not signing.  He said he actually didn't have a problem with the fact that they were making money off of it -- he made millions so if they made $50 off his sig, he didn't care -- but his objection was their attitude.  One of entitlement -- and that they were just unpleasant.  After too many of those types of experiences, he was frustrated at the negativity and lack of any sort of appreciation, so he decided he just wasn't doing it anymore.  

[IntoAnother]

14 hours ago, Comicbookscalping said:

Did anyone else experience this?

Yup, I was with Lauren and heard it all. It was said in a rather annoyed tone and it was indeed someone from the Marvel booth. 

I do not know if he was going rogue, if Jason asked that to be announced, or if it came from the top down though. That is in no way an excuse for the rule, I just wanted to make that clear. 

In my opinion several people need to wake up to the fact that TRUE FANS also collect CGC graded comics. I buy, sell, and collect books, just as many of us do.

To say we are not fans is absurd.